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Mike Holt
Member
USA
2807 Posts |
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MarchBrown
Contributor
USA
34 Posts |
 Posted - 05/05/2006 : 10:56:19 AM
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| Looks like a Blue Quill, Paraleptoplebia(sp?) |
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Ken Allen
Frequent Contributor
724 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 07:09:21 AM
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Paraleptophlebia adoptiva (blue quill), like all the Paraleptophlebia genus, have three tails, not two.
I wonder if this mayfly is in the Baetis genus, which I know little about. I also wonder if the two-tailed red quill on the St. George and other Mid-coast drainages are Baetis, too.
This photo is a wonderful example of two characteristics of a spinner -- elongated front legs and tails. These appendages, I believe, help hold the female during procreation. |
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Streamer
Big Fish in a Small Pond
USA
1980 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 09:14:06 AM
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(Taken from the Friday Update)
Mike found this on the shop door yesterday, apparently waititng to come in, and (it being the first mayfly he'd seen this year) Mike obliged. By the time I got there (ten of ten), Mike had him in a display case by the cash register, so I got to look at him close up. It's hard to tell from the photograph, but this little guy does have 3 tails. |
Streamer
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Streamer
Big Fish in a Small Pond
USA
1980 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 09:51:10 AM
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This link:
http://www.flyfishingentomology.com/index.html
has a simplified identification window. However, when I input the description of the Mayfly, it comes back with no match (maybe I'm getting the length-without the tails-wrong). Maybe someone else will have better luck with it.
There's also a names button; there are about 30 types of Blue Quills, and a distribution button; many Blue Quills (of the Leptophlebiidae family: Paraleptophlebia, Tricorythodes, Choroterpes, Leptophlebia, and Habrophlebia) can be found in the Northeast. Unfortunately, there are no photographs in this site, so matching the insect by picture comparison isn't possible.
PS: I did a quick search in the names section for "Red Quills", and there's not a Baetis in the bunch... |
Streamer
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Edited by - Streamer on 05/06/2006 10:05:04 AM |
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Admin
Forum Admin
USA
502 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 10:08:31 AM
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Streamer's correct it does have three tails the center one being about 1/2 the length of the other two. Also it is much bigger than a Blue Quill.
I should have noted the length of the bug for those of you who are trying to look this thing up.  It is a big bug an easy 10 - 12 hook size. The bug itself is about 15 millimeters in length not counting the tails or front legs.
I just couldn't get to it yesterday but I'll be looking for a match to this mayfly in my books today.
I'll post if I figure it out. 
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Taxon
Starting Member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 3:03:11 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Streamer
This link:
http://www.flyfishingentomology.com/index.html
has a simplified identification window. However, when I input the description of the Mayfly, it comes back with no match (maybe I'm getting the length-without the tails-wrong). Maybe someone else will have better luck with it.
There's also a names button; there are about 30 types of Blue Quills, and a distribution button; many Blue Quills (of the Leptophlebiidae family: Paraleptophlebia, Tricorythodes, Choroterpes, Leptophlebia, and Habrophlebia) can be found in the Northeast. Unfortunately, there are no photographs in this site, so matching the insect by picture comparison isn't possible.
PS: I did a quick search in the names section for "Red Quills", and there's not a Baetis in the bunch...
Streamer-
I believe the mayfly in question to be a Black Quill, Leptophlibia cupida male imago.
The probable reason you didn't get a match is that 15 mm. is not within the published body length range for a Leptophlebia spinner. I suspect 15 mm. may be an exaggeration of body length, as it seems to be in disparity with the #10-#12 hook size estimate.
Here are the parameters I entered and the description of the insect that my Adult Mayfly Identification screen ultimately led to:
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Adult Mayfly Identification
Number of tails = 3
Body length = 12 mm.
Fore wings = ?
Hind wings = ?
Other distinguishing characters: middle tail shorter
Emergence water type: ?
Emergence behavior: ?
Emergence light condition: ?
Geographic location: USA:NE
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Scientific name: Leptophlebia cupida
Previously know as: Baetis ignava, Blasturus austrinus, Blasturus collinus, Blasturus concinnus, Blasturus cupidus, Blasturus gravastellus, Cloe quebecensis, Ephemera cupida, Ephemera hebes, Ephemerella quebecensis, Heptagenia quebecensis, Leptophlebia austrina, Leptophlebia
Common name: Black Quill
Locality: E, M, W
Voltinism:
Emergence (begin) date: mid-Apr
Emergence (end) date: late-Aug
Emergence time of day: midday and afternoon
Spinner fall time of day: afternoon
Dun minimum length: 9 mm.
Dun maximum length: 12 mm.
Dun identification keys:
Dun body description: dark brown or brownish gray w/distinct banding
Dun wings: dark slate gray, heavily washed w/brown, darkest in stigmatic area, large eliptical hind wing w/o costal angulation
Dun legs: front black, rear creamish brown
Dun tails: 3, olive-brown, paler than body
Spinner identification keys: male claspers w/3 joints; head of male dark brown, almost black; bases of antennae ringed w/dark brown; face margined w/dark brown; eyes large, not meeting on top of head; eye of male conspicuously divided into lower and upper parts, upper element dark mahogany-brown, lower element nearly black
Spinner minimum length: 8 mm.
Spinner maximum length: 12.5 mm.
Spinner body description: dark reddish brown w/pale yellow bands
Spinner wings: hyaline w/light to medium brown veins; forewings base and stigmatic area lightly washed w/brown
Spinner legs: bases ringed w/dark brown, femora and tibiae of forelegs dark brown, nearly black, tarsi smoky-brown, middle and hind legs medium brown w/olive reflections, tarsi slightly darker than femora and tibiae
Spinner tails: 3, smoky-brown, darker basally, paler apically, narrowly ringed w/dark brown at joinings; middle tail weaker and slightly less than half as long as outer two
If you (or any other listeners) have any questions concerning use of my Adult Mayfly Identification screen, or anything else concerning aquatic insects, I'd be more than happy to answer them. |
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com |
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Streamer
Big Fish in a Small Pond
USA
1980 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 7:15:03 PM
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WOW!  THANKS, Roger! (And welcome to the forum). Not only do you have a top-notch site, you provide knowledgeable help and answers at the mere mention of your name
I think the host of this forum, Mike Holt, will sleep easier tonight. We tried to identify it yesterday, secretly hoping that it signalled the beginning of the Hendrickson hatch here (which, of course, is when dry fly fishing really "turns on"). We pored through three or four books of insects, trying to find a match, but there was always something "missing"...two tails instead of three, different size, wing coloring, etc., on and on. Mike had said at the time that it was going to bother him until he found out what it was. He was going through another book when I left. Later in the day, I noticed this post, asking if anyone could identify it, and realized that this was still "bugging" him. |
Streamer
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Taxon
Starting Member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 9:27:34 PM
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Streamer-
Thanks for the welcome. My goal is to stimulate discussion and understanding of aquatic entomology within the flyfishing community, so I promptly respond to any new link to my site, even one embedded in a forum post. Allowing Mike to sleep easier may be a bit beyond the scope of my ambition, but if that's the result, so much the better.
The problem you and Mike were having with identifying an adult mayfly is exactly why I developed a simplified identification method. Previously, most flyfishers were stuck with looking though books for pictures of adult mayflies, which often works if one has access a great enough variety of pictures, but most don't, and even then it can become quite frustrating, as you indicated.
If you're chomping at the bit for the Hendrickson hatch, you might want to warm up for it by reading the The Hendrickson Hatch (http://www.FlyfishingEntomology.com/Article%20The%20Hendrickson%20Hatch.htm, an article I wrote for Hatches Magazine last spring. |
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com |
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Streamer
Big Fish in a Small Pond
USA
1980 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2006 : 10:50:37 PM
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| I very much enjoyed reading your article. What I like best about your writing style is that you explain things in plain language, so that anyone can follow. That's not always an easy thing to do...as our knowledge on a subject evolves, we sometimes have a tendency to litter our conversations with techno-speak (in this case, techno-speak would entail a lot of Latin), and this leaves readers behind, disinterested in the dust. You have a way of speaking to others who may not be as knowledgeable as you are without speaking down to them, and I find that refreshing. I look forward to reading more of your work in the future. Thanks for sharing. |
Streamer
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Taxon
Starting Member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2006 : 12:59:56 AM
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Streamer-
Thank you. One attempts to impart some knowledge without overwhelming a majority of the audience. In your case at least, it appears the proper balance was struck. However, others may well have a less charitable view. In any event, your kind words are most sincerely appreciated. |
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com |
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Ken Allen
Frequent Contributor
724 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2006 : 07:03:58 AM
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Roger,
Just out of curiosity, I was wondering about a mayfly that hatches on Maine's Mid-coast rivers and streams that have a silt bottom with a somewhat stiff current but not enough to wash away the silt. I intend to send one to Dennis LaBaron and/or Tom Ames should I run into one in the next week or two. (I suspect the Kennebec will drag me from the Mid-coast, though!)
The mayfly from the silt-bottom streams and rivers looks like a red quill. It is imitated by a size 14 dry fly hook and has rather dark dun wings, legs and TWO tails. The body is dark mahogany a la male E. subvaris (only darker). I suspect it is a minor Maine hatch. The two tails make it odd.
Anyway, I was looking in Knopp and Cormier and began wondering if the mystery fly was Baetis brunneicolor. K and C just don't have enough info in the book to nail it down, though.
I think Baetis flies are a whole new frontier in Maine that have been largely ignored.
Streamer, I suspect B. brunneicolor goes by a colloquial name with "brown" in it, not "red quill." I can't emphasize enough that this fly to which I refer is a mystery species in Maine.
By the way, this is one of the best threads I have seen on these Maine fly-fishing boards. |
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Taxon
Starting Member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2006 : 1:00:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Ken Allen
Roger,
Just out of curiosity, I was wondering about a mayfly that hatches on Maine's Mid-coast rivers and streams that have a silt bottom with a somewhat stiff current but not enough to wash away the silt. I intend to send one to Dennis LaBaron and/or Tom Ames should I run into one in the next week or two. (I suspect the Kennebec will drag me from the Mid-coast, though!)
The mayfly from the silt-bottom streams and rivers looks like a red quill. It is imitated by a size 14 dry fly hook and has rather dark dun wings, legs and TWO tails. The body is dark mahogany a la male E. subvaris (only darker). I suspect it is a minor Maine hatch. The two tails make it odd.
Anyway, I was looking in Knopp and Cormier and began wondering if the mystery fly was Baetis brunneicolor. K and C just don't have enough info in the book to nail it down, though.
I think Baetis flies are a whole new frontier in Maine that have been largely ignored.
Streamer, I suspect B. brunneicolor goes by a colloquial name with "brown" in it, not "red quill." I can't emphasize enough that this fly to which I refer is a mystery species in Maine.
By the way, this is one of the best threads I have seen on these Maine fly-fishing boards.
Ken-
Based on the information you provided, my best guess would be Little Slate-Winged Brown Quill (Baetis brunneicolor), with Little Quill Gordon (Cinygmula subaequalis) running a distant second. You didn’t mention the hind wings. Baetis brunneicolor would have minute hind wings, and Cinygmula subaequalis would have obvious hind wings. Both of these species inhabit Maine streams, and are spring emergers. Physical description and habitat would far favor Baetis brunneicolor. |
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com |
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